Gay couple ‘kicked out of Soho pub for kissing’

There is no question that pub landlords are perfectly free to throw out customers. You are a guest in the licencee's establishment. When asked to do (or not do) something and you refuse, a request to leave is to be expected. It was not discriminatory...they were not refused service on the grounds of sexuality, nor discriminated, they were merely asked not to continue an activity! They failed to comply with the request and it's their own fault.

There is not a right to kiss, or kiss in public.

Jonathan and James need to calm down and use some common sense. They had dozens of gay venues to choose from within a very short walking distance, so why pick an obviously straight pub? This has all the hallmarks of the recent story about the gay couple that sued the B&B owners - it sounds like a complete set-up and does the gay 'community' no favours at all. And yes, I'm gay.

It is often not a case of discrimination, rather the simple fact that punters and bar staff alike can't stand Public Display's of Affection.

In my uni years, as a bar man, I told untold hundreds of gay and straight couples to stop kissing in various pubs and bars I worked in. All were of the belief that PDA's (and 'snogging' defo qualifies) was not appropriate for the bar. They'd get a couple of warnings (light hearted, then a bit more serious) and most people sheepishly agreed to calm their passions. I didn't always agree with the decision, but it was a blanket ban on 'heavy petting' across the sexual spectrum.

The initial argument is a non-story, really. The facts are vague and seem sketchy at best. It is likely to be blown out of all propotion by the Twittersphere and lazy journos looking to fill space and tick boxes.

The landlord does sound like a dick, mind, although I like the Snow as it's cheap and a great location. It won't stop me drinking there.

As a gay man i would love to stick up for you here, but after hearing thefull story I can't really blame them for throwing you out.

Not being funny, but if you are in a straight bar and asked to stop kissing then maybe you should of done so. That or left on your own accord and gone somewhere more gay friendly (you were in soho afterall).

Yes I know that it shouldn't matter if you are gay/straight and kissing in any bar, but people in that pub may of choose to drink there because it was a straight bar - if they wanted to see gay people kissing then they would of gone else where.

If the pub/manager was homophobic then you should of takenthe first comment as a cue to take you business elsewhere, not provoke anyone by continuing your actions then expect an apology when asked to leave.

Lazy single-issue reporting, providing an aggrieved party with a soapbox to air his version of events.

Mr Williams' story is so full of unimportant wishy-washy drivel and so empty of hard fact as to be laughable - he says that he will "write a letter of complaint to head office as soon as [he] can" - I assume that he will find some time after his next round of media interviews is over. It is a great shame that So So Gay is so full of its own self-importance as to publish this story in this form.

I would like to point out that if Mr Williams and his silent partner were entirely innocent in this incident, were not antagonistic or inappropriate, and behaved as model citizens in the face of horrific prejudice from the intoxicated landlord, the nameless publican, and potentially the possible plain-clothed policeman (I'm unable to tell whether he's a goodie or a baddie in this story) then they deserve all the support that we can muster for their campaign.

There is no question that pub landlords are perfectly free to throw out customers. You are a guest in the licencee's establishment. When asked to do (or not do) something and you refuse, a request to leave is to be expected. It was not discriminatory...they were not refused service on the grounds of sexuality, nor discriminated, they were merely asked not to continue an activity! They failed to comply with the request and it's their own fault.

There is not a right to kiss, or kiss in public.

Speaking as a "straight" I am disgusted by some of the separatist attitudes here, it does not matter if it was a gay or straight venue, the intolerance cannot be tolerated- he had a right to a personal display of affection in line with any other person, it's pretty clear he did not. A fuss should be made, bigots should be shamed, and the battle should be fought on every front until it no longer matters to anyone.

Under the Equality Act anyone, gay or straight, subsequently thrown out of the pub for protesting to the landlady about her action ALSO has a valid claim of discrimination against the pub. I would strongly encourage those others who were kicked out after challenging what happened to consider legal action and claim damages.

The fact is, we did tone it down. It was very literally a peck as we were getting ready to leave that brought the two publicans and off-duty-officer down on us. I'm sorry if that offends any of you but I am not sorry for giving my date a quick kiss on the lips.

Jonathan and James need to calm down and use some common sense. They had dozens of gay venues to choose from within a very short walking distance, so why pick an obviously straight pub? This has all the hallmarks of the recent story about the gay couple that sued the B&B owners - it sounds like a complete set-up and does the gay 'community' no favours at all. And yes, I'm gay.

It is often not a case of discrimination, rather the simple fact that punters and bar staff alike can't stand Public Display's of Affection.

In my uni years, as a bar man, I told untold hundreds of gay and straight couples to stop kissing in various pubs and bars I worked in. All were of the belief that PDA's (and 'snogging' defo qualifies) was not appropriate for the bar. They'd get a couple of warnings (light hearted, then a bit more serious) and most people sheepishly agreed to calm their passions. I didn't always agree with the decision, but it was a blanket ban on 'heavy petting' across the sexual spectrum.

The initial argument is a non-story, really. The facts are vague and seem sketchy at best. It is likely to be blown out of all propotion by the Twittersphere and lazy journos looking to fill space and tick boxes.

The landlord does sound like a dick, mind, although I like the Snow as it's cheap and a great location. It won't stop me drinking there.

I would like to be able to stand up as an openly gay man and say this was discrimination or blatant homophobia, but I don't believe it was either.

First, we have to remember that the pub in question is a straight pub. Secondly, we have to remember that some people are uncomfortable with public displays of affection in any environment - I, for one, do not want to walk down the street and see two people trying to ingest each other's last meals, much in the same way I object to people spitting out great puddles of phlegm. It's given that you would expect to see gay couples kissing in a gay venue, but not in a straight bar. And by being confrontational with the staff and clientele is almost inviting the couple to be queer bashed. Not every member of society is tolerant of other's situations - we only have to cast our minds back to the Admiral Duncan for a painful reminder of that.

The fact that the John Snow is in Soho is irrelevant - so are a lot of other straight pubs and - more importantly - dozens of gay venues where this would not have been an issue. I think the couple in question should show other members of society the same level of tolerance as they expect themselves. This article does the couple no favours - they just come across as a pair of whiny queens throwing their toys out of their prams.

Look forward to reading the full story on this.

How on earth can kissing constitute being offensive? You've just got to ask the question whether it is acceptable for the landlord to have turfed out a black or Jewish couple on the same grounds.

Of course it's not. This is homophobia.

It's one thing being asked to tone down your behaviour, gay or straight, it's another being made to leave in an agressive and embarassing way.

Get a room next time!

As a gay man i would love to stick up for you here, but after hearing thefull story I can't really blame them for throwing you out.

Not being funny, but if you are in a straight bar and asked to stop kissing then maybe you should of done so. That or left on your own accord and gone somewhere more gay friendly (you were in soho afterall).

Yes I know that it shouldn't matter if you are gay/straight and kissing in any bar, but people in that pub may of choose to drink there because it was a straight bar - if they wanted to see gay people kissing then they would of gone else where.

If the pub/manager was homophobic then you should of takenthe first comment as a cue to take you business elsewhere, not provoke anyone by continuing your actions then expect an apology when asked to leave.

Shame on the publicans at John Snow - one of my favourite pubs in London.

Lazy single-issue reporting, providing an aggrieved party with a soapbox to air his version of events.

Mr Williams' story is so full of unimportant wishy-washy drivel and so empty of hard fact as to be laughable - he says that he will "write a letter of complaint to head office as soon as [he] can" - I assume that he will find some time after his next round of media interviews is over. It is a great shame that So So Gay is so full of its own self-importance as to publish this story in this form.

I would like to point out that if Mr Williams and his silent partner were entirely innocent in this incident, were not antagonistic or inappropriate, and behaved as model citizens in the face of horrific prejudice from the intoxicated landlord, the nameless publican, and potentially the possible plain-clothed policeman (I'm unable to tell whether he's a goodie or a baddie in this story) then they deserve all the support that we can muster for their campaign.